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Failing out |
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trueindigo 
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 Topic: Failing outPosted: Feb/11/2013 at 6:14pm |
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As a lurker here trying to decide about this as a career I really only have one question: over and over I read about how many people "fail out" of this industry and the high attrition rate. Exactly how does one define failing out? Does that mean they projected a six figure income and never made it, or what? What exactly does this mean? Thanks to everyone. Great forum.
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True Indigo
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Chief
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 6:16pm |
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It means no job..fires..let go..
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"You like winning don't you?" "Saves you from having to say the word please."
Good point Chief. Iceco1d 10/30/12 |
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trueindigo
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 6:23pm |
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Speaking to staff at College for Financial Planning there was no real data on attrition by age, the assumption that younger FP's at 25 right out of college were cannon fodder and had a hard time getting someone 65+ to trust them with their portfolio, as opposed to a middle aged man or woman, etc. From some of the posts I read, sometimes I get the feeling this is a horrific career or, for the too dumb to fail, just the right thing? Really, just an honest query, because the profession sounds very risky. Could you?
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True Indigo
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City1134
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 6:32pm |
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Army13A
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 7:16pm |
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Failing out means you're not making enough money to support yourself or family. If you're young and have no liabilities, you can survive making 40-50K/year for a number of years while you're building a business/trail revenue. If out the gate your hurdle to break even is 5-8K/month, that's tough.
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mobile2
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 7:54pm |
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Failing out = not generating enough revenue, either by commissions or fees, for the firm to keep you around. One day you're there and then you're not.
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trueindigo
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 8:09pm |
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Thank you for your help. I can survive on vapors.
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True Indigo
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trueindigo
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 8:10pm |
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Thank you for your input. Nothing is easy. Nothing.
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True Indigo
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Delbs
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 8:18pm |
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Just do it, especially if your young. If you succeed you can have an unbelievable lifestyle. If you fail, you probably only gave up a year or two of your working career. Its worth the risk.
Also, you can be young and act young. Or you can be young and exude confidence and act like a leader. Your choice and the clients can tell.
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B24
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 8:56pm |
^This. When you are young and have few responsibilities (wife, kids, house, etc.), there is no reason not to swing for the fences. But the key is, you have to be willing to work your balls off to make it happen, and work SMART (in other words figure out the right way to be successful). I wish I had happened upon this business before I had kids. You have to think of it as starting your own business. Read Inc. Magazine and many of the stories about how people built businesses. Yes it's a sales business early on, but ALL businesses are pretty much sales businesses. The one downside of this career/business, is that you are (for most advisors) constantly selling to consumers, not other businesses. So the sales cycle and psychology needed for success is much different than in B2B industries. I think this is why people that think they are great "salespeople" often fail out of this business.
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JYD
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 10:40pm |
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People fail out because almost everyone I have ever seen get into this business underestimates how otherwise rational people get completely irrational about how they approach their money. Nothing happens on your time frame. You have to work incredibly hard, and many days without reward. You will fail so much more often than you succeed. That is hard on a psyche. I guess I was just dumb enough to not take it personally.
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trueindigo
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 10:49pm |
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54. still young enough for me. the only question is am i young enough for ej or another noob position? i know all about the 3 years of 1500 cc's a week, etc. and the beyond stupid dedication to the phones. that's just sticking to the basics. just don't know what failing out means exactly. or the numbers. or why the attrition rates. like that. any global perspectives? thanks for your reply good sir.
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True Indigo
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trueindigo
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 10:56pm |
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thanks b.
no kids. no mortgage. small teacher stipend. second career. cant' imagine working a regular j....j.....ugh....job ever again. doctors, lawyers, business owners, all of them worked their balls off for at least 3-5 years before getting up on step. if that's what it takes to succeed then i'm in. just don't need to crush the jewels needlessly. the general flavor of what i'm seeing here is work like a slave for the first 3-5 and then it's possible to let off on the gas and spend more time advising and less cc'ing. if that's all it takes great, but i also see posts of smart, hard working, dedicated people failing out. so there must be more to this than simply being a workhorse. i'm sure you would say, go for it. nothing to lose. right?
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True Indigo
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Sportsfreak
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 11:15pm |
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True Indigo -
Failing out can mean either 1. you don't bring in assets fast enough for the firm to be ok with you and they dump you, and you can't find another firm to take you on. 2. You work your balls off and still can;t bring in enough money to make a living, and you give up, and decide its not for you As far as being 54, I started at age 49, so just a bit younger than you. I worked my ass off. I'm not a natural, at prospecting, maybe you are, but i can only speak from my experience. Don't remember i think it took me 5 years to get to 100k. If you don't need a lot of money to live and you can find a firm that will be patient, and allow you to grow at your own pace (forget the big dogs, i.e. Merrill, Morgan Stanley, etc,) then you can make it. And lets say you build a business where you are making 125-150k revenues, in 6-7 years - you can then enjoy that income without working too hard for the next 10, or 15 years if you are lucky enough to stay healthy. The nice thing about this business is that you can work forever, or as long as you want to, and you dont have to work a full week if you build it right.
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If you eat an entire cake without cutting it, then technically, you only had one piece
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 11:20pm |
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SF, I wish you would give yourself more credit about prospecting. You're fucking good at it (talking to people, calling, etc.). You're just fucking terrible at DOING it.
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trueindigo
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 11:31pm |
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I know there are some flamethrowers on this forum but I just want to thank you sincerely, as one human being to another, don't know who you are, but thank you for being honest and real and really, pretty much giving me the stupidity to think why the hell not. sometimes that's all it takes, just being dumb enough not to know better and smart enough to make it work. thanks man. really. thank you.
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True Indigo
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Sportsfreak
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 11:38pm |
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I have a feeling you will do well. By your own standards. Which at this stage of your (and my) life, should be the only standards that count.
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If you eat an entire cake without cutting it, then technically, you only had one piece
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trueindigo
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Posted: Feb/11/2013 at 11:59pm |
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truth be said. truth be said.
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True Indigo
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trueindigo
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Posted: Feb/12/2013 at 11:48am |
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SF, sorry for leaning on you lad, but when you said stay away from the big outfits, I'm assuming you mean also EJ, and instead going to boutiques and RIA's and working for one of those and starting a 500 day war? Just a little more direction and I'm off and running. Thanks again.
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True Indigo
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Sportsfreak
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Posted: Feb/12/2013 at 1:30pm |
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I was referring to the wirehouses, not EJ, although i suspect it is the same with EJ, with whom i have no first hand knowledge, only what i read here from the kool aide types. My point was, at the wires you will be forced to satisfy their standards, not your own. Specifically i mean ML, Morgan Stanley, UBS and Wells, although I Am Legend can speak with more knowledge regarding Wells, i think they are a little less rigid than the others, I am not sure. And i don't know if UBS is even hiring newbies.
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If you eat an entire cake without cutting it, then technically, you only had one piece
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trueindigo wrote: